Dontopedia

Lohe

From Dontopedia, the open, paraconsistent wiki. (Last updated 2026-06-06.)

Lohe has 142 facts recorded in Dontopedia across 28 references, with 8 live disagreements.

142 facts·118 predicates·28 sources·8 in dispute

Mostly:rdf:type(7), uses(6), is backprop free(2)

Maturity scale raw canonical shape-checked rule-derived certified

Inbound mentions (40)

Other subjects in dontopedia point AT this entity as a value. These are inverse relationships — e.g. "X motherOf this subject" — and answer questions the forward facts can't. Grouped by predicate.

aboutAbout(1)

announcedDiggingIntoDetailedDataAnnounced Digging Into Detailed Data(1)

announcedFoundBothProblemsAnnounced Found Both Problems(1)

areCompletelyFrozenAre Completely Frozen(1)

causesNoiseIssueForCauses Noise Issue for(1)

changesBy3e-6PerStepChanges By3e 6 Per Step(1)

collaboratesOnCollaborates on(1)

decreasesMonotonicallyDecreases Monotonically(1)

describesDescribes(1)

describesComparisonDescribes Comparison(1)

dominatedByBlockUpdatesDominated by Block Updates(1)

expectedToImproveExpected to Improve(1)

implyNonlinearExponentialBehaviorImply Nonlinear Exponential Behavior(1)

includesOptimizerIncludes Optimizer(1)

includesSeparateLrOscIncludes Separate Lr Osc(1)

interferesWithKuramotoSyncInterferes With Kuramoto Sync(1)

involvesOptimizerInvolves Optimizer(1)

isActivatedByIs Activated by(1)

isGradientNormalizationKillingMagnitudeIs Gradient Normalization Killing Magnitude(1)

isLowerFidelityUpdateIs Lower Fidelity Update(1)

isLr1e-4OverDampeningOscillatorParamsIs Lr1e 4 Over Dampening Oscillator Params(1)

isPotentialImprovementOverIs Potential Improvement Over(1)

measuredByValPplMeasured by Val Ppl(1)

measuresSpeedMeasures Speed(1)

notLookingGoodNot Looking Good(1)

preservesGradientMagnitudeFor1dOscillatorParamsPreserves Gradient Magnitude For1d Oscillator Params(1)

previouslySuggestedWorsePerformancePreviously Suggested Worse Performance(1)

providesRealOrderParameterToProvides Real Order Parameter to(1)

questionsMonotonicLinearBehaviorQuestions Monotonic Linear Behavior(1)

relatesToRelates to(1)

reportsExperimentalResultsReports Experimental Results(1)

sharesGpuUsageWithShares Gpu Usage With(1)

shouldPerformMuchBetterShould Perform Much Better(1)

showsStabilityShows Stability(1)

signalsPhysicsModeSignals Physics Mode(1)

suspectsNormalizationInterferesWithSignalingSuspects Normalization Interferes With Signaling(1)

trainedWithTrained With(1)

usedInGatingUsed in Gating(1)

usesDirectlyInUses Directly in(1)

usesOptimizerUses Optimizer(1)

Other facts (135)

The long tail: predicates that appear too rarely to warrant their own section. Filter or scroll to find a specific one. Each row links to its source.

135 facts
PredicateValueRef
Rdf:typeAlgorithm[21]
Rdf:typeSoftware System[22]
Rdf:typeOptimizer Class[23]
Rdf:typeOptimization Algorithm[24]
Rdf:typeOptimizer[25]
Rdf:typeOptimizer[26]
Rdf:typeSoftware Component[28]
UsesKan Gates[1]
UsesLinearized Error Propagation[1]
UsesHarmonic Decomposition[1]
UsesRotational Updates[1]
UsesLohe Synchronization[1]
UsesLinearized Error Propagation[12]
Is Backprop Freetrue[1]
Is Backprop Freetrue[12]
Has Val Ppl1119933.4[2]
Has Val Ppl349.9[10]
Has Val Loss13.9288[2]
Has Val Loss5.8577[10]
At StepStep 200[10]
At StepStep 100[10]
Has Metric Value0.59[21]
Has Metric Value5.8[21]
Interpretationno phase ordering[21]
Interpretationnot learning structure from scratch[21]
Has Built inHarmonic Decomposition[1]
Integrates Ka Ngatestrue[1]
Captures Attention Order Parameters ViaHooks[1]
Captures Via HooksAttention Order Parameters[1]
Is Numbered4[1]
Feeds Back IntoOptimization[1]
Is Not Viable atthis depth/scale[2]
Completely Divergedtrue[2]
Has Tr Loss13.6893[2]
Has Tokens Per Sec21902[2]
Uses Backpropno[2]
Presupposes Mean Field Limittrue[2]
Has Ppl Approx1000000[2]
Has Highest LossExperiment Setup[2]
Deemed Not Viabletrue[2]
Has Vs Unig7.2888[2]
Uses Gpu Gb3[2]
Has Fastest Tok Per Sec21902[2]
Has Ms Per Step181[2]
Has Tr Ppl881394.4[2]
Achieves Ppl27.9[3]
Exists Currentlycurrent[3]
Relates toBoltzmann Distribution[4]
Has InternalGet Temperature Scheduler[4]
With Coupling0.2[5]
Uses Lr Ffn0.06[5]
Causes RotationWeight Updates[5]
Depends onFeatures Tensor[5]
Is forBackprop Free Fine Tune[5]
Has Speed Advantage17K vs 11.6K tok/s[6]
Experiences No CrashDuring Training[6]
Confirms Compatibility WithLohe V2 Ffn[6]
Has Recommended Use CaseFine Tune From Pretrained Only[6]
Presupposes Pretrained Models ExistFor Fine Tuning[6]
Expected to Convergetrue[7]
References Harmonic Mlx RepoGithub Link[7]
Has Oscillator ParametersKappa[7]
Faster Wall Time2.2 min[7]
Involves1d Oscillator Paramstrue[7]
Is Linearized Gradient Methodtrue[7]
Performs Poorly onPretrained Checkpoint[8]
Actively DestroyingCheckpoint[8]
Started FromVal Ppl 417 Pretrained[8]
Is Spiking to15-17[8]
Gates UsingR Global[9]
Uses Gate4·r·(1-r)[9]
Returned toWorking State[10]
Has Wall Time S54.5[10]
Has Tok Per S15030[10]
Has Train Loss5.909[10]
Confirmed Workingtrue[10]
Presupposes Prior Non Working StateWorking State[10]
Preferred Optimizertrue[10]
Adapts to Attention TypeLohe Spherical[11]
Detects AutomaticallyR Global[11]
Switches toPhysics Gate[11]
Advertised AsBackprop Free Linearized[12]
IsOptimizer[12]
Syncs Without BackpropLohe Sync[13]
Previously Used Hardcoded R0.5[13]
Never Run WithForm 2 Gate Active[13]
Presupposes No Backprop ViabilityLohe Sync[13]
Works onFinetune[14]
Seemed to Work Only onFinetune[14]
Fails to Reduce Loss onPretraining or Smoketest[14]
Lacks Awareness ofLoss Decrease[14]
Related to HistoricalSynchronization Optimizers[15]
Has Forward Only Pathtrue[16]
OptimizesSphere Geometry[17]
Is Compared toRot Adam W[17]
Optimizes DirectlySphere Geometry[17]
OutperformsRot Adam W[17]
Rejects Form2 Lohe Attention WhenH Not Equals 4[18]
Avoids Autograd Backwardtrue[19]
Measured at ScaleSix Layer Scale[19]

Timeline

Timeline axis is valid_time — when each source says the fact was true in the world, not when Dontopedia learned about it. Retracted rows are kept for provenance; coloured stripes indicate the context kind.

usesblah/watt-activation/part-117
ex:kan-gates
hasBuiltInblah/watt-activation/part-117
ex:harmonic-decomposition
usesblah/watt-activation/part-117
ex:linearized-error-propagation
integratesKANgatesblah/watt-activation/part-117
true
capturesAttentionOrderParametersViablah/watt-activation/part-117
ex:hooks
capturesViaHooksblah/watt-activation/part-117
ex:attention-order-parameters
isNumberedblah/watt-activation/part-117
4
isBackpropFreeblah/watt-activation/part-117
true
usesblah/watt-activation/part-117
ex:harmonic-decomposition
feedsBackIntoblah/watt-activation/part-117
ex:optimization
usesblah/watt-activation/part-117
ex:rotational-updates
usesblah/watt-activation/part-117
ex:lohe-synchronization
isNotViableAtblah/watt-activation/part-121
this depth/scale
completelyDivergedblah/watt-activation/part-121
true
hasTrLossblah/watt-activation/part-121
13.6893
hasTokensPerSecblah/watt-activation/part-121
21902
usesBackpropblah/watt-activation/part-121
no
presupposesMeanFieldLimitblah/watt-activation/part-121
true
hasPplApproxblah/watt-activation/part-121
1000000
hasHighestLossblah/watt-activation/part-121
ex:experiment-setup
deemedNotViableblah/watt-activation/part-121
true
hasVsUnigblah/watt-activation/part-121
7.2888
usesGpuGbblah/watt-activation/part-121
3
hasFastestTokPerSecblah/watt-activation/part-121
21902
hasMsPerStepblah/watt-activation/part-121
181
hasValPplblah/watt-activation/part-121
1119933.4
hasValLossblah/watt-activation/part-121
13.9288
hasTrPplblah/watt-activation/part-121
881394.4
achievesPplblah/watt-activation/part-123
27.9
existsCurrentlyblah/watt-activation/part-123
current
relatesToblah/watt-activation/part-179
ex:boltzmann-distribution
hasInternalblah/watt-activation/part-179
ex:_get-temperature-scheduler
withCouplingblah/watt-activation/part-191
0.2
usesLrFfnblah/watt-activation/part-191
0.06
causesRotationblah/watt-activation/part-191
ex:weight-updates
dependsOnblah/watt-activation/part-191
ex:features-tensor
isForblah/watt-activation/part-191
ex:backprop-free-fine-tune
hasSpeedAdvantageblah/watt-activation/part-183
17K vs 11.6K tok/s
experiencesNoCrashblah/watt-activation/part-183
ex:during-training
confirmsCompatibilityWithblah/watt-activation/part-183
ex:lohe-v2-ffn
hasRecommendedUseCaseblah/watt-activation/part-183
ex:fine-tune-from-pretrained-only
presupposesPretrainedModelsExistblah/watt-activation/part-183
ex:for-fine-tuning
expectedToConvergeblah/watt-activation/part-192
true
referencesHarmonicMLXRepoblah/watt-activation/part-192
ex:github-link
hasOscillatorParametersblah/watt-activation/part-192
ex:kappa
fasterWallTimeblah/watt-activation/part-192
2.2 min
involves1dOscillatorParamsblah/watt-activation/part-192
true
isLinearizedGradientMethodblah/watt-activation/part-192
true
performsPoorlyOnblah/watt-activation/part-190
ex:pretrained-checkpoint
activelyDestroyingblah/watt-activation/part-190
ex:checkpoint
startedFromblah/watt-activation/part-190
ex:val-ppl-417-pretrained
isSpikingToblah/watt-activation/part-190
15-17
gatesUsingblah/watt-activation/part-199
ex:r-global
usesGateblah/watt-activation/part-199
4·r·(1-r)
returnedToblah/watt-activation/part-196
ex:working-state
hasWallTimeSblah/watt-activation/part-196
54.5
hasTokPerSblah/watt-activation/part-196
15030
hasTrainLossblah/watt-activation/part-196
5.909
confirmedWorkingblah/watt-activation/part-196
true
presupposesPriorNonWorkingStateblah/watt-activation/part-196
ex:working-state
preferredOptimizerblah/watt-activation/part-196
true
atStepblah/watt-activation/part-196
ex:step-200
hasValLossblah/watt-activation/part-196
5.8577
atStepblah/watt-activation/part-196
ex:step-100
hasValPplblah/watt-activation/part-196
349.9
adaptsToAttentionTypeblah/watt-activation/part-201
ex:lohe-spherical
detectsAutomaticallyblah/watt-activation/part-201
ex:r-global
switchesToblah/watt-activation/part-201
ex:physics-gate
isBackpropFreeblah/watt-activation/part-189
true
advertisedAsblah/watt-activation/part-189
ex:backprop-free-linearized
usesblah/watt-activation/part-189
ex:linearized-error-propagation
isblah/watt-activation/part-189
ex:optimizer
syncsWithoutBackpropblah/watt-activation/part-205
ex:lohe-sync
previouslyUsedHardcodedRblah/watt-activation/part-205
0.5
neverRunWithblah/watt-activation/part-205
ex:form-2-gate-active
presupposesNoBackpropViabilityblah/watt-activation/part-205
ex:lohe-sync
worksOnblah/watt-activation/part-214
ex:finetune
seemedToWorkOnlyOnblah/watt-activation/part-214
ex:finetune
failsToReduceLossOnblah/watt-activation/part-214
ex:pretraining-or-smoketest
lacksAwarenessOfblah/watt-activation/part-214
ex:loss-decrease
relatedToHistoricalblah/watt-activation/part-211
ex:synchronization-optimizers
hasForwardOnlyPathblah/watt-activation/part-221
true
optimizesblah/watt-activation/part-228
ex:sphere-geometry
isComparedToblah/watt-activation/part-228
ex:rot-adam-w
optimizesDirectlyblah/watt-activation/part-228
ex:sphere-geometry
outperformsblah/watt-activation/part-228
ex:rot-adam-w
rejectsForm2LoheAttentionWhenblah/watt-activation/part-261
ex:h-not-equals-4
avoidsAutogradBackwardblah/watt-activation/part-294
true
measuredAtScaleblah/watt-activation/part-294
ex:six-layer-scale
implementsJacobianChainblah/watt-activation/part-294
true
hasStepBreakdownblah/watt-activation/part-294
ex:lohe-optimizer-step-breakdown
hasSlownessPercentageblah/watt-activation/part-294
7
testedAtSixLayersblah/watt-activation/part-294
true
hasNearIdenticalForwardblah/watt-activation/part-294
ex:rotadamw
sharesModelForwardWithblah/watt-activation/part-294
ex:rotadamw
scalesLinearlyWithLayersblah/watt-activation/part-294
ex:block-update-cost
hasBatchedEvalImprovementblah/watt-activation/part-294
17
couldBecomeFasterThanblah/watt-activation/part-294
ex:rotadamw-backward
isSlowerThanblah/watt-activation/part-294
ex:rotadamw
performsBetterRelativelyAtSmallerScaleblah/watt-activation/part-294
ex:six-layer-scale
improvedAfterBatchingblah/watt-activation/part-294
true
isBiologicalStyleUpdateRuleblah/watt-activation/part-213
forward-pass-only for fine-tuning
notSuitableForblah/watt-activation/part-213
from scratch training
isDifferentFromblah/watt-activation/part-213
ex:rot-adam-w
typeblah/watt-activation/186
ex:Algorithm
labelblah/watt-activation/186
Lohe
metricStatusblah/watt-activation/186
flatline across all metrics
hasMetricValueblah/watt-activation/186
0.59
hasMetricValueblah/watt-activation/186
5.8
interpretationblah/watt-activation/186
no phase ordering
interpretationblah/watt-activation/186
not learning structure from scratch
labelblah/watt-activation/188
LoheOptimizer
typeblah/watt-activation/188
ex:SoftwareSystem
typeblah/watt-activation/189
ex:OptimizerClass
labelblah/watt-activation/189
LoheOptimizer
hasDescriptionblah/watt-activation/189
backprop-free, linearized error propagation
backpropStatusblah/watt-activation/189
backprop-free
errorPropagationMethodblah/watt-activation/189
linearized error propagation
typeblah/watt-activation/190
ex:OptimizationAlgorithm
labelblah/watt-activation/190
LoheOptimizer
hasValidationPplStartblah/watt-activation/190
417
spikingToblah/watt-activation/190
15-17
hasEffectOnblah/watt-activation/190
ex:pretrained-checkpoint
destroyingblah/watt-activation/190
ex:pretrained-checkpoint
hasIssueblah/watt-activation/190
ex:spiking-behavior
typeblah/watt-activation/210
ex:Optimizer
labelblah/watt-activation/210
Lohe optimizer
typeblah/watt-activation/220
ex:Optimizer
labelblah/watt-activation/220
LoheOptimizer
hasPathTypeblah/watt-activation/220
ex:forward-only-path
findsblah/watt-activation/227
ex:gelation-attractor
findsBeforeblah/watt-activation/227
ex:gradient-based-optimizer
typeblah/watt-activation/292
ex:SoftwareComponent
labelblah/watt-activation/292
LoheOptimizer
totalStepTimeblah/watt-activation/292
492.5
hasThroughputblah/watt-activation/292
66500
forwardCaptureTimeblah/watt-activation/292
143.4
hasNoteblah/watt-activation/292
same as RotAdamW forward
blockUpdateTimeblah/watt-activation/292
344.3
blockUpdatePercentageblah/watt-activation/292
70
gpuSyncBarrierCountblah/watt-activation/292
77
r_globalItemTimeblah/watt-activation/292
2.7

References (28)

28 references
  1. [1]Part 11712 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/part-117
  2. [2]Part 12116 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/part-121
  3. [3]Part 1232 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/part-123
  4. [4]Part 1792 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/part-179
  5. [5]Part 1915 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/part-191
  6. [6]Part 1835 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/part-183
  7. [7]Part 1926 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/part-192
  8. [8]Part 1904 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/part-190
  9. [9]Part 1992 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/part-199
  10. [10]Part 19611 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/part-196
  11. [11]Part 2013 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/part-201
  12. [12]Part 1894 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/part-189
  13. [13]Part 2054 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/part-205
  14. [14]Part 2144 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/part-214
  15. [15]Part 2111 fact
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/part-211
  16. [16]Part 2211 fact
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/part-221
  17. [17]Part 2284 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/part-228
  18. [18]Part 2611 fact
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/part-261
  19. [19]Part 29414 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/part-294
  20. [20]Part 2133 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/part-213
  21. [21]1867 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/186
    • full textwatt-activation-186
      text/plain3 KBdoc:agent/watt-activation-186/28dd0cf1-877b-4d3c-8650-c102a40c3031
      Show excerpt
      [2026-03-10 03:00] lisamegawatts: might need to feed it how to compute these [2026-03-10 03:00] xenonfun: `logs/phase_metrics_20260309_225648.jsonl` log collections ``` {"r": 0.6015, "b": 5.6972, "pm": 0.2788, "pv": 0.1787}, {"r": 0.5995, "
  22. [22]1882 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/188
    • full textwatt-activation-188
      text/plain3 KBdoc:agent/watt-activation-188/0b24c5f9-ca6d-47b7-9d97-98b6fac36e0c
      Show excerpt
      [2026-03-10 03:16] xenonfun: well I imagine data from working RotAdamW will be informative for it as to how to correct behavior / step issues in LoheOptimizer [2026-03-10 03:17] xenonfun: also that will be recorded [2026-03-10 03:38] xenonf
  23. [23]1895 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/189
    • full textwatt-activation-189
      text/plain2 KBdoc:agent/watt-activation-189/ee6e7700-8f8f-458c-bd97-cd00204ffe29
      Show excerpt
      [2026-03-10 03:42] xenonfun: ``` What the fix looks like: Coupling κ_g is a scalar per group. Its gradient through the sync step is tractable: at first order, Δcoupling_g ∝ -(∂loss/∂spectra_synced) · (mean_spec_g - spectra_g) — the reado
  24. [24]1907 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/190
    • full textwatt-activation-190
      text/plain3 KBdoc:agent/watt-activation-190/afd2a2d6-55fc-43d9-9655-83cd2755213f
      Show excerpt
      [2026-03-10 03:51] xenonfun: ⏺ The fix is working. Here's the comparison: ``` ┌────────────────┬────────────────┬────────────────────────────┐ │ Metric │ Before fix │ After fix │ ├────────────────┼────────
  25. [25]2102 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/210
    • full textwatt-activation-210
      text/plain2 KBdoc:agent/watt-activation-210/20d41130-276e-4126-8cde-1fc6d9275db1
      Show excerpt
      [2026-03-11 03:59] omega [bot]: The spectral and harmonic signatures being equivalent means that the graph spectral decomposition (eigenvalues/eigenvectors of graph Laplacian or adjacency) directly corresponds to the harmonic modes of the s
  26. [26]2203 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/220
    • full textwatt-activation-220
      text/plain3 KBdoc:agent/watt-activation-220/5c7f4a28-90e7-46de-ae1e-9e19a58c8d65
      Show excerpt
      [2026-03-11 04:42] xenonfun: FFN DFT — much richer specialization than spectral: ``` ┌─────┬───────┬────────┬────────────────┬────────────────┐ │ blk │ r │ FFN DC │ dominant mode │ pattern │ ├─────┼───────┼────────┼───────
  27. [27]2272 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/227
    • full textwatt-activation-227
      text/plain2 KBdoc:agent/watt-activation-227/68739c39-b81e-46d6-a743-64f53964d850
      Show excerpt
      [2026-03-11 05:22] xenonfun: ⏺ The data shows it clearly. The gelation onset is between step 100 and step 200: step loss b9_r b10_r b11_r b10−b11 b9_disorder 100 11.80 0.363 0.347 0.362 −0.014 −0.016 ← symmetric,
  28. [28]29210 facts
    ctx:discord/blah/watt-activation/292
    • full textwatt-activation-292
      text/plain2 KBdoc:agent/watt-activation-292/126da404-b457-4703-9947-909873e9c37a
      Show excerpt
      [2026-03-14 03:52] xenonfun: ``` ⏺ There it is: LOHE OPTIMIZER STEP BREAKDOWN (492.5 ms total, 66.5K tok/s) ├── Forward + capture: 143.4 ms (29%) — same as RotAdamW forward ├── Block updates: 344.3 ms (70%) ← THE

See also

Keep researching

Missing something or suspicious of what's here? Kick off a research session — a Claude agent will investigate, cite its sources, and file new facts into a dedicated context you can review before accepting into the shared view.